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Explore the effectiveness of naturopathic medicine in promoting holistic well-being. Join Dr. Daniel Rubin, a renowned naturopathic oncologist, as he shares insights from over 20 years of practice. Discover the integrative approach that prioritizes patient resilience and overall health.

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Your host, Nathan Crane, is a Certified Holistic Cancer Coach, Best-Selling Author, Inspirational Speaker, Cancer-Health Researcher and Educator, and 20X Award Winning Documentary Filmmaker with Over 15 Years in the Health Field.

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Audio Transcript

 

(This transcript was auto-generated so there may be some errors)

00:00:00:03 – 00:00:28:02
Nathan Crane
Welcome back to the podcast. I am super excited to have Dr. Daniel Rubin here with us. Dr. Dan is a naturopathic oncologist with over 20 years of practice in Arizona. 2004, he became the founding president of the Oncology Association of Naturopathic Physicians and has become an internationally recognized naturopathic oncologist. Dr. Rubin is co-founder and medical director of Naturopathic Specialists in Scottsdale, Arizona, which is a beautiful place.

00:00:28:02 – 00:00:49:14
Nathan Crane
We were just talking of offline here, and that’s where we did our Holistic Leadership Council retreat last year. And it was just one of the most beautiful places in the desert there to do it. He practices full time as a physician, and he’s an expert in the naturopathic approach to people with cancer who are either unable to undergo conventional therapy or who choose not to.

00:00:50:05 – 00:00:52:23
Nathan Crane
Dr. Dan, thanks for coming on the podcast, man.

00:00:54:09 – 00:00:58:15
Dr. Dan Rubin
Love it. Thank you for having me. Looking forward to chatting and getting to know you.

00:00:59:04 – 00:01:08:05
Nathan Crane
Absolutely. So for people who don’t know. Can you explain the difference between naturopathic oncology and conventional oncology?

00:01:09:00 – 00:01:40:14
Dr. Dan Rubin
No. So absolutely. Been doing this for 27 years and started in the late nineties, got out of school at a naturopathic medical school and all I was really interested in was oncology. And at that time there was very little known in the non-conventional world. And compared to where we are right now with the conventional world, there was also very little known as things went.

00:01:40:20 – 00:02:05:06
Dr. Dan Rubin
Early on in my career, we had really a we didn’t really know about integrative oncology. We were just kind of doing what we were doing conventional, were doing what we were doing. But I during my schooling and during my initial residency, I spent a lot of hours in hospitals and in conventional offices because especially during school, I knew that my patients that I was seeing were primarily going through conventional treatments.

00:02:05:06 – 00:02:38:19
Dr. Dan Rubin
So I felt the duty to go learn about that. So I probably did a couple hundred extra hours just going around into these obviously, you know, cold calling from the back of your classroom, trying to get in. And that was in the mid-nineties. Fast forward a little bit, and the realization struck me that really conventional oncology, in my opinion, I’m saying this because I don’t know all of your listenership and I’m certainly not a purist when it comes to it’s naturopathic oncology or non-conventional or that’s it.

00:02:39:20 – 00:03:09:20
Dr. Dan Rubin
I’m an integrative doc and I foresaw through my work that conventional oncology was headed in a very reasonable and a good direction, and I really put the effort in and wanted to. I understood that the grand majority of patients are going to be undergoing something conventional. So again, it’s my duty to understand oncology first, view naturopathic oncologist second, and see how we could team up.

00:03:11:06 – 00:03:32:04
Dr. Dan Rubin
And I ditched the word complementary a long time ago. I ditched the word alternative a long time ago. And really just focused on integrative because we’re working together in the village. And that’s how we’ve built our practice here in Scottsdale, right behind on the Honor Health campus at 92nd. And Shea, for those of you who know the area.

00:03:33:04 – 00:03:56:10
Dr. Dan Rubin
Right directly behind me is a big research pavilion and the building right well, to the left of the screen is I think there’s six oncology practices, radiation oncology. And this is a hospital campus. So we’re not employees, but we’re tenants in the building. And we deliberately put our practice here. We had to get vouched for and accepted by the CEO and head oncologist had about four.

00:03:56:10 – 00:04:35:16
Dr. Dan Rubin
So we’re integrative oncology. The difference is conventional oncology. Again, this is my opinion. Conventional oncology is so far superior at killing cancer cells than we are as non-conventional lists. And that’s everybody else that’s doing oncology work, in my opinion, who is not using a chemotherapeutic, a biological or radiation surgical intervention in conventional immunotherapy. Anything that goes or comes from the conventional side, they’re good at killing, but they’re not good at the resilience.

00:04:35:16 – 00:04:57:05
Dr. Dan Rubin
They’re not good at treating the human aspect of everything else in the bio physiology. And the reason I know that is because I don’t have ten clinics, because I’m constantly getting referrals from medical oncology. They don’t utilize us as much. They do have dieticians, they do have some integrative centers. They have art therapy, massage therapy, yoga, acupuncture, certainly, you know, some of the larger centers here.

00:04:57:13 – 00:05:22:10
Dr. Dan Rubin
But on the whole, they lack absolute understanding. A lot of the doctors are very frightened of the what they believe the possibility is from a protocol, from a doctor like myself, even though I’m so seasoned. So I would say nature partic oncology joins in the village of nonconventional practitioners and we do what we do for the person with cancer.

00:05:22:13 – 00:05:44:13
Dr. Dan Rubin
That’s not conventional care. And don’t get me wrong, I respect the heck out of conventional oncology and where it’s going. What I don’t respect is the lack of the fundamental need for everything else that it takes for a human to be resilient and a human to trudge through those therapies. Because we know that the success rate, you know, it’s a general success rate.

00:05:44:13 – 00:06:01:14
Dr. Dan Rubin
It doesn’t work all the time, doesn’t work a large portion of the time for different types of cancers at different stages. And so how do you then support a patient so those treatments can either be more effective or they get at least, you know, through the system, get to the next treatment that may have a better chance of working.

00:06:01:14 – 00:06:23:22
Dr. Dan Rubin
We can discuss what that means. And so I know it’s a long winded definition. It’s not really a true definition of naturopathic oncology, but I think through our discussion with people hang on and listen, they’ll begin to understand how a naturopathic doctor who then specializes in oncology and is a board certified naturopathic oncologist would approach the person with cancer.

00:06:24:06 – 00:06:38:10
Dr. Dan Rubin
And it all starts with that lingo. We don’t use cancer patient in our clinic. We use person with cancer. So we’re already elevating the person above the disease and above the diagnosis. And that’s fundamental. So it’s a huge part of how we start. Thank you.

00:06:38:12 – 00:07:14:15
Nathan Crane
That’s huge. I mean, everything you know, so much of health and healing comes down to perspective and our own perspective on the disease that we might be diagnosed with and how that impacts us mentally, emotionally and psychologically, physically, spiritually, in every way possible. And yeah, we can dove into the details and the science behind that as well. But I’ve heard it said so powerfully that if you’re sick and you go to your doctor and your doctor doesn’t ask you about your diet, about exercise, about your sleep, about stress in your life, about the environment in which you live.

00:07:15:22 – 00:07:32:10
Nathan Crane
And all they do is prescribe you a drug. Then they’re not really a doctor, they’re a drug dealer. And I know that sounds harsh, but when you put it in such simple terms, I mean, how can you see it any other way?

00:07:32:10 – 00:07:56:14
Dr. Dan Rubin
Well, I can’t agree with you just because I’m in the community and I can’t put that label on my colleagues who might just give a drug. I think we in my opinion, I would qualify that differently because obviously you’ve seen your primary care and you might go for an acute visit. And I don’t think you mean somebody who just has pneumonia and goes to their doctor real quick and does get the drug, but they’re not discussing it.

00:07:57:00 – 00:08:28:09
Nathan Crane
Let’s say let’s let’s qualify and say cancer, diabetes, heart disease, right. Lifestyle, diet and lifestyle related diseases, diseases that we know are primarily preventable in the mass majority of the human population. Now, of course, aside from, you know, people being born with certain disorders, which is a very, very small percentage of population, but the largest the largest cohorts of people who have these chronic metabolic diseases are primarily diet and lifestyle related and transcend, you know, genetic, genetic predisposition.

00:08:28:17 – 00:08:48:03
Nathan Crane
So I would say in that context and like I said, it is harsh and I’ve I heard it said recently and I thought, you know what? That’s very, very powerful. And to a lot of people, that’s how they see it. You know, they’re seeing it more that way that, you know, you have cancer, you have diabetes, you have heart disease, you’re obese, you have, you know, fibromyalgia, whatever it is.

00:08:48:03 – 00:09:08:22
Nathan Crane
And you go in and your doctor doesn’t ask you anything about diet and lifestyle. And all they do is prescribe your drug. You know, how is that health care today? I mean, how can you call that health care when they’re not truly trained in how to take care, help you take care of your health when in fact they’re prescribing a drug that are primarily masking symptoms?

00:09:09:09 – 00:09:31:13
Dr. Dan Rubin
Yeah, well, we would say it’s sick care. It’s not health care. And that’s a misnomer. It’s sort of the reason that why do you have to have an organic section in or a health food section in the grocery store like that? It doesn’t make sense. And so you’re talking about a system that really they don’t think about it.

00:09:31:22 – 00:09:51:01
Dr. Dan Rubin
There’s a belief system as well. And that’s another word that we really try to keep out of our clinic is belief, not when we’re talking about spirituality, but when we’re talking about a patient comes in and says, Well, I’m not going to tell my oncologist that I’m seeing you because they don’t believe in this. And I’m like, Well, there’s nothing to believe in.

00:09:51:09 – 00:10:16:18
Dr. Dan Rubin
I’m a human with a clinic, and we have substances that have known mechanisms of action and data behind it. It’s not belief. It’s it’s subjective. And that’s how it that’s how I approach that. And so it’s you’re you’re listeners, you myself know that it’s a huge system with a large population, with a low budget, with high influence from pharma.

00:10:16:22 – 00:10:47:07
Dr. Dan Rubin
And that’s probably the root of many things. And it’s a system that is so enormous that trying how do you fix something that that is that big and you start by people investing in themselves and brave people that have courage like yourself, that are willing to stand up and be on podcasts and interview people like myself, people like myself that had the courage to go to school 30 years ago, you know, way long before this was even popularized.

00:10:47:07 – 00:11:09:17
Dr. Dan Rubin
And we’ve had to fight the system for years and stand for what we knew was right. It harkens back to the days and this is just so I mean, it’s really it’s really funny when we used to get scolded for giving probiotics. Now everything’s about the microbiome. And I understand the science is better, or one of the other things is that we need these.

00:11:09:17 – 00:11:34:13
Dr. Dan Rubin
What I always get chastised for is giving bioidentical hormones and now everybody’s giving them. And these docs are coming out of their insurance based practices and they’re going to they’re seeing the cash. And it’s you know, they laugh at us and is knowing basic physiology and how to work with the body and use and reasonability. And then we get laughed at and then, you know, and made fun of.

00:11:34:13 – 00:11:58:24
Dr. Dan Rubin
And then we we continue to do what is right. And then they just follow, you know, the hand up following along. And it does make me laugh because it’s, it’s, unfortunately it’s not funny like haha it’s funny like, you know, if I could just go back to that day and show them what’s going on, what they would be doing today and 2024, it would just feel good not like I need to get back at anybody.

00:11:58:24 – 00:12:25:02
Dr. Dan Rubin
I’m totally, you know, happy with how our career, my career has been. But it’s really important to recognize that we have a system that is trying to cater to all the different incomes, including people that don’t have non-government until income. And that becomes really difficult. And I think you and I would probably agree that it boils down to education.

00:12:25:23 – 00:12:43:21
Dr. Dan Rubin
Look at what’s on TV. Look at what’s available. And we’re in an era now where social media is. So grab a ball by everybody. You don’t have to watch network TV because look at the commercials. You know, when I mean, I don’t even watch network TV, but when I do for a special, I see like the Super Bowl or something.

00:12:43:21 – 00:13:06:04
Dr. Dan Rubin
I saw how many drug commercials I was. I was amazed. I was like, wow, I didn’t know that was happening. But, you know, the understanding of how a human is supposed to treat the human body just hasn’t been broadcast. But nowadays and with the upcoming generations, the info is there. That’s my that’s my opinion.

00:13:06:04 – 00:13:32:14
Nathan Crane
Yeah, I agree with that completely. You know, you talk about having to, you know, defend for the right to be able to treat patients with naturopathic medicine and for the right to continue, you know, sharing what you do. And, you know, that’s very common in this country, in the United States, where these natural forms of medicine are constantly under attack.

00:13:32:24 – 00:13:55:10
Nathan Crane
You’re in Arizona, so I’m sure or loved to ask you, did you hear about the Arizona House bill 2739 that just that was introduced in February of 2024? It was the it was a proposal that seeks to dissolve the board of homeopathic and Integrative Medicine Examiners in Arizona.

00:13:56:19 – 00:14:08:04
Dr. Dan Rubin
Well, they I don’t know. You know, I’m actually on our licensing board and they may interesting dissolve that I wonder if there’s somehow becoming a we’re absorbing them somehow.

00:14:08:06 – 00:14:17:09
Nathan Crane
So the the bill was to it was proposed to transfer all the powers duties and remaining funds to the board of the Naturopathic Physicians Medical Board.

00:14:17:17 – 00:14:34:07
Dr. Dan Rubin
Okay, there we go. So then that makes sense. So then we’ll share executive directors. I mean, here I am literally on the licensing board. I didn’t go to the meeting. The meeting was actually yesterday. I wasn’t able to make it. I just haven’t been apprized in a very interesting.

00:14:34:07 – 00:14:49:13
Nathan Crane
Do you know why that would happen? Because I have homeopathic medical medical doctors who are also trained as homeopathic medical doctors. They hold both licenses. I think in Arizona, who are completely against that and have been asking for people to vote against that bill because they don’t want that.

00:14:49:21 – 00:15:22:17
Dr. Dan Rubin
Yeah, I would vote against that as well. You would. We’ve absorbed the duties of our executive director and it’s probably based on funding and that our board has traditionally been strong. This is actually my 12th year on our board. Have to observe two six year government appointed or a governor appointed, whatever you call it, terms. And we’re not I mean, we’re trained in homeopathy, but we don’t have an MD behind our name and we’re not MDs, you know, and so I don’t know how that’s going to work.

00:15:22:17 – 00:15:48:02
Dr. Dan Rubin
I don’t know all the legislation and administration behind that mean we’ll do what we need to do. I think if of above all, we understand the intent of that board I was around when that homeopathic board was developed. I, you know, been around this amount of time and people you know who started Ira a scam and the collation docs and all that.

00:15:48:03 – 00:16:18:00
Dr. Dan Rubin
I mean, I was they were my original mentor. Some of them have passed. So I’ve seen I’ve seen the homeopathic develop and I just been around those docs. So I, I think if intent is there, we hold that. But we’re certainly we don’t, I don’t know all the laws, so I would vote against it as well as long as there was funding and maybe there’s not enough docs around that even comprise a board, you know, it might just be sort of logistics and not, you know, another issue or foul play or something like that.

00:16:18:16 – 00:16:20:14
Nathan Crane
Do you know, do you know Dr. Thomas loading?

00:16:21:09 – 00:16:22:15
Dr. Dan Rubin
I know, yeah, I know him.

00:16:23:08 – 00:16:26:11
Nathan Crane
He’s a he’s an MDH he’s, he’s got a clinic there in.

00:16:27:06 – 00:16:27:13
Dr. Dan Rubin
The.

00:16:27:19 – 00:16:29:23
Nathan Crane
South of Phenix, I believe. I care. I think it’s.

00:16:29:23 – 00:16:41:18
Dr. Dan Rubin
Macy’s in Lodi which is part of our clinic. At one time, back when we had Ed and clinic back in Tempe, when we used to do immunotherapy back way back in the day, that was the late nineties.

00:16:41:18 – 00:17:00:09
Nathan Crane
Yeah, I know. He was against that bill. He was talking with me about it. I saw it was introduced February. It didn’t so far. I don’t know what’s happened to it. There’s not enough information on the website like it doesn’t say, you know, if the voting habit doesn’t say it passed the House or the Senate or anything, but I’m not sure what’s happened on the voting or if they didn’t vote or if they held at all think.

00:17:00:17 – 00:17:03:12
Dr. Dan Rubin
It was just introduced. You know how things go slowly.

00:17:03:12 – 00:17:04:15
Nathan Crane
Yeah, yeah, that’s true.

00:17:05:13 – 00:17:07:21
Dr. Dan Rubin
It’s got to be argued. And then it’s going to be now.

00:17:08:13 – 00:17:11:10
Nathan Crane
Yeah, yeah. I just know he was really against it for whatever reason.

00:17:11:10 – 00:17:21:17
Dr. Dan Rubin
Yeah. Well, I mean, it’s like taking away the war dead, you know, they it’s like they’re born. I mean, if all of a sudden we were absorbed by, like, the chiropractic board, I’d be like, they’re totally not nature pathetic. Doctor. Right.

00:17:21:23 – 00:17:48:13
Nathan Crane
Exactly. Exactly. There’s differences, but it’s, you know, it’s, you know, natural medicine goes back. It’s so funny. We we call conventional medicine tradition or medicine, but traditional medicine is actually what’s been traditionally used for thousands of years. So if you go back to TCM, traditional Chinese medicine, which is all natural in nature or holistic in nature, you go back to are you Vedic medicine from India, which goes back 5000 plus years, that’s traditional medicine.

00:17:48:20 – 00:18:04:12
Nathan Crane
Indigenous medicine is traditional medicine where that word kind of got co-opted today, where, you know, now we call conventional medicine, traditional medicine. But traditional is actually what our ancestors have always used, which is natural in nature, clearly.

00:18:05:02 – 00:18:16:11
Dr. Dan Rubin
I mean, it’s only been a few years since we’ve had technology that we consider technology. I mean, you hearken back. Exactly. And it’s a shame.

00:18:17:13 – 00:18:49:07
Nathan Crane
So I am in agreement with you, though, on the integrative aspect. I actually produced a film a few years back called Cancer The Integrative Perspective, and I spent about five years directing, producing, editing, narrating that film. It’s since won, I think, over 20 awards now, and it was really exploring that idea of, you know, how do we take the best of all worlds, the best of natural medicine, holistic or evaded traditional Chinese medicine, energy medicine and conventional medicine, the best of what we have today, technologically low dose chemotherapy.

00:18:49:07 – 00:19:13:17
Nathan Crane
IPT is a potentially therapy, for example. Sometimes, you know, you’ve got I just talked to a woman from my I am a partner in a company called Conquering Cancer and we do, you know, coaching and master classes and documentary series. And we have people have been following our programs last few years and reaching out to us and and sharing with us their cancer healing stories, you know, reversing stage three, stage four cancers following our work.

00:19:13:17 – 00:19:35:00
Nathan Crane
I talked to a woman the other day who said she had tumors wrapped all up and down her spine. It metastasized throughout her entire body. She got it. She had to get, you know, flown in for an emergency spinal surgery. And, you know, that’s surgery. You know, getting those tumors off her spine saved her life. And then she says, you know, I changed my diet.

00:19:35:00 – 00:19:57:00
Nathan Crane
She started cancer all over. But she she did around the chemo. And it made her unbelievably sick. And she just said, no way, she’s around the radio. Radiotherapy, radiation. It just tore her up. She said, no way. She changed her diet lifestyle, detox, you know, emotional healing, all the things that we teach through my company. And here she is, you know, a couple of years later saying, you know, we absolutely saved her life.

00:19:57:00 – 00:20:17:07
Nathan Crane
She’s just crying and sharing her story that she she says she wouldn’t be here without all the things that she’s been doing. And that’s an integrative approach. Right. She had surgery to help Mason save her from being paralyzed or dying, like literally within weeks, potentially, and then changed all the other aspects that are extending her life and improving.

00:20:17:07 – 00:20:34:08
Nathan Crane
What she said now is, you know, it’s significantly improve the quality of her life because she had so much pain, she couldn’t get out of bed, you know, and now she’s got a mountain bike. She’s mountain biking through the mountains, you know, she’s gardening. She’s doing all this stuff. And her quality of life, you know, she still has some of the cancer there, but some of it has regressed.

00:20:34:15 – 00:20:37:17
Nathan Crane
And her quality of life has significantly increased.

00:20:38:04 – 00:20:39:08
Dr. Dan Rubin
Cancer saved her life.

00:20:40:09 – 00:20:49:20
Nathan Crane
You hear that so often, right? Because and it’s not because the cancer is is because of the perspective on the cancer. Right.

00:20:49:20 – 00:21:13:10
Dr. Dan Rubin
That’s a beautiful story. I mean, thank you for sharing in that. It’s a true integrative case. Those technology in medicine is great when you need it. The problem with conventional medicine is that there’s not a general acceptance of all the other things that are out there that have science and experience behind it. And that’s what I continually say is I’m here and literally across the street.

00:21:13:10 – 00:21:36:06
Dr. Dan Rubin
And literally as we were starting this podcast, I was texting the radiation oncologist because he just referred a patient over to me and we were just talking about the referral and why would they refer to me. It’s because I communicate with them, number one. Number two, I asked to speak the language of oncology and I understand the principles and practice of it.

00:21:36:24 – 00:22:05:23
Dr. Dan Rubin
Number three, I consider every every doctor is a doctor first. Then you can specialize, you can be allopathic, you can be naturopath, it can be chiropractic, then you can subspecialties, then you can be an allopathic oncologist, you can be a naturopathic oncologist, you can be a neurologist, you can be a chiropractic neurologist. So we’re all doctors. The original definition of doctors teacher Doc Ray, one of the highest precepts in naturopathic medicine doctor is teacher, which is what you’re talking about.

00:22:05:23 – 00:22:35:13
Dr. Dan Rubin
You you educate people. You have this podcast for its conquering cancer. It’s why you made your famous move video The Cancer, the integrative perspective, which I saw. I mean, we all saw it, right? I mean, we need that stuff. And it’s about good bringing to light and bringing forward trust in cancer. So that is why in 2004, I founded the Oncology Association of Naturopathic Physicians.

00:22:35:13 – 00:22:56:16
Dr. Dan Rubin
Right. That’s my dear friend Jason Herman up in Alaska to do this motivating reason to protect people with cancer. I’m in Arizona seven years out of school. I’m 100% oncology in my practice and had been except for a little we did a little HIV work through the school. I just I needed a second job, you know, early on.

00:22:56:16 – 00:23:18:17
Dr. Dan Rubin
And so I managed HIV clinic for them, which at the time back in the late nineties, oncology hematology, they were seeing patients with HIV and AIDS. So it was natural. So, you know, we understood and Kaposi sarcoma, which came out of that. So, you know, we you know, I did that job as well. Point is, in the state of Arizona, it was unprofessional conduct to refer to yourself as a specialist.

00:23:19:01 – 00:23:44:06
Dr. Dan Rubin
So how could I get the word out that I’m 100% on ecology to patients? And this is back in oh four, right? Without calling myself a specialist or an oncologist, I wasn’t allowed to use any word that suggested that. So what we had to do was get acceptance by the board. So in order to get the board to recognize me as a naturopathic oncologist and get a specialty certificate, we had to have a great endeavor.

00:23:44:13 – 00:24:11:08
Dr. Dan Rubin
So we started we founded the Ecology Association of Naturopathic Physicians, and through that, we developed the American Board of Naturopathic Oncology. And by 26, we had our first seven board certified naturopathic oncologists on the continent. Now there’s over 200 new true specialists. And so by I think I’m looking at the plaque on my wall, I have the very first oncology specialty certificate on my wall over here from the state of Arizona.

00:24:11:08 – 00:24:32:02
Dr. Dan Rubin
So we were fine. We got acceptance through our national organization and we got it. And I was finally recognized by our board, and I’m a board certified naturopathic ecologist. Why did I do it? I did it to protect the public because oncology moves fast. It’s highly complicated and you can’t just dabble in it and really help people the way that they want to be helped.

00:24:32:15 – 00:24:54:10
Dr. Dan Rubin
And that’s a really important point, too, because there’s so much out there now that people are able to consume and social media on the Internet. But I just a shout out to us practicing for us practicing physicians that are still in the trenches every day who this is what we do and a shout out to and a warning for people who think that they can do this on their own.

00:24:54:14 – 00:25:17:12
Dr. Dan Rubin
Sometimes you can, but most of the time you have got to put the work in the hands of people of skill and understand this, because the depth of what needs to be done is not something that you can kind of hack together from searching the Internet. Some of us can write, some of us have skill. I mean, obviously, some of us are physicians.

00:25:17:12 – 00:25:25:05
Dr. Dan Rubin
We understand stuff, but I see a lot of people come into my practice who tried to do that and didn’t do it right.

00:25:25:11 – 00:25:50:07
Nathan Crane
It’s complicated. It’s complicated. Even even in our, you know, cancer group coaching program, we still highly encourage and recommend everybody have at least an integrative oncologist in their corner. If not, you know, even three doctors that they can at least consult with, even a conventional, you know, oncologist for testing and so forth, a naturopathic physician. We always recommend.

00:25:50:07 – 00:26:14:19
Nathan Crane
And then, you know, some again, I don’t like the term alternative or complementary either. But, you know, whether it’s whatever somebody’s leaning more towards, it could be, you know, TCM, it could be homeopathic, whatever, but bare minimum having, you know, an integrative oncologist that you that you trust and who can be there in your corner because it is complicated, you know, cancer is on one end.

00:26:14:19 – 00:26:43:17
Nathan Crane
It’s like really simple. Once we dove into the literature and understand what actually causes cancer, like it’s actually very simple. But when it’s spread throughout your entire body, it’s metastasized. Stage four, you know, it’s through your lymphatic system. It’s in your lungs. It’s all over the place. Like that is complicated. And, you know, no matter what route you take, there’s no guarantees, there’s no oncologists, no, you know, holistic doctor that can guarantee you that you’re going to have success.

00:26:43:17 – 00:27:08:10
Nathan Crane
No amount of drugs, nothing. But there is what I always tell people is, you know, when you got the right people in your corner and you have hope and you’re focused on finding the best solutions and you’re staying positive, we know through the psychological studies that have been done on cancer patients who have thrived, who’ve beaten cancer and thrive, that that positive mental attitude is actually one of the commonalities among conquer.

00:27:08:10 – 00:27:10:19
Nathan Crane
You know, cancer conquers, as I like to call them.

00:27:11:18 – 00:27:13:23
Dr. Dan Rubin
So well said and so important.

00:27:14:19 – 00:27:28:10
Nathan Crane
So I want to ask you, one of those core causes of cancer clearly is inflammation and not just inflammation, but chronic inflammation. Can you talk about that?

00:27:29:01 – 00:27:51:18
Dr. Dan Rubin
Oh, yeah. I mean, we live in a society that is chronically inflamed. You know, a good portion of us sit in a cubicle with, you know, glaring overhead lights. They’re not full spectrum. They don’t have access to daylight, the breathing, indoor air almost all the time, you know, at 3:00 when they have an adrenal drop and they get hungry, they go to the vending machine, buy a Coke and a York Peppermint Patty and play with their insulin.

00:27:52:05 – 00:28:14:08
Dr. Dan Rubin
And maybe they’re frustrated that their job and then they get in their car, maybe they maybe they live in the upper northwest where they don’t see a lot of sun. They get home, there’s more indoor, you know, it’s like things like that. If that’s a, you know, potentially typical American lifestyle, then your relationship with nature is different. You know, the distance that you view with your eyes in 3D is different.

00:28:14:08 – 00:28:36:06
Dr. Dan Rubin
You know, a lot of people get the reality represented on a 2D screen, which is just really difficult for the brain to interpret. And there is EMF all around us. There’s stressors that we don’t understand. Maybe it’s just driving in traffic every day. Maybe it’s, you know, maybe you’re able to conquer some of your stress, but the food that you eat doesn’t give you the nutrients in order to do that.

00:28:36:15 – 00:29:11:13
Dr. Dan Rubin
And so you have a missing link and you just have, you know, constitutive level or custodial custodial amount of inflammation we need. Right. That’s part of our response. It’s just like we need a stress response just when it gets overbearing and we can’t control it. And so America’s chronically inflamed from our sleeping habits to our food supply, to our vacation schedules, to wanting to look good on social media, turn out walking to work, to maybe the way that we, you know, interact for, you know, traveling for work and just all of the things that were exposed to.

00:29:11:13 – 00:29:37:08
Dr. Dan Rubin
And like you said before, you mentioned genomics or genetics. And we’re unique and people have different susceptibilities. And so inflammation takes a toll on our genetics. And we know that. I mean, the definition of a cell that has become cancerous is when something goes. There’s an error in the division, in the genetic code of the cell that just divide it.

00:29:37:09 – 00:30:01:04
Dr. Dan Rubin
Now you have a cancer cell. And there’s that adage that, oh, everybody has cancer cells all the time in their body. And that’s true. I mean, the older we get, the less cells are dividing, but the more mistakes that we can make. And infamous if a cells has corrupted sort of software architecture and doesn’t have the capacity for self-destruction, then you get cell survival.

00:30:02:09 – 00:30:27:01
Dr. Dan Rubin
And then that cell has replicative ability. And then now you have two cells and then, you know, exponentially they grow as long as, you know, they can escape immune surveillance and they can survive. So from an inflammatory perspective, I when I talk when I talk about diet with people and I don’t do a ton of the diet work in our clinic, but you can’t escape diet.

00:30:27:01 – 00:30:51:09
Dr. Dan Rubin
We’re human. So we have to think about our diet. And I talk about fruits and vegetables, plant food, high in photonic energy. Right. This clinic is about the sun or about resilience. You know, we practice the resilience model of cancer care. We we talk about the sun and not just because we’re in Arizona, but just because it’s a real entity.

00:30:51:09 – 00:31:20:10
Dr. Dan Rubin
And I think there’s not enough we don’t talk enough about the sun in medicine. There’s no I mean, there no real clinics are outdoors. Some clinics don’t even have natural light. Some doctors don’t even really understand that. But we all know how we feel. We go to the sun. So you have one of the highest expressions of plants is the fruit and I tell people, okay, imagine my white shirt or this blue, whatever color I’m wearing, if I take a blueberry and rub it on there, it’s going to stain.

00:31:21:16 – 00:31:38:09
Dr. Dan Rubin
That thing has high photonic energy and that’s something that I say goes like this sorry my computer, but goes like this Thou shall not pass right. They are the protectors of the genes. And so the more photonic energy and and.

00:31:38:24 – 00:31:41:22
Nathan Crane
What did you say is a protector of the genes that cut out?

00:31:41:22 – 00:31:55:03
Dr. Dan Rubin
I’m sorry, that was me. Things like berries, those high expressions of this, of the plant that carry a lot of photonic energy are thou shall not pass or protectors of the genes they happen to be anti inflammatory.

00:31:55:11 – 00:32:26:17
Nathan Crane
That’s and the specifics in those are the things like the polyphenols clearly the antioxidants right. I mean all this stuff has been researched so deeply. I mean, the vitamins and minerals, right. The phytonutrients, fighting, meaning plants. It’s so funny. You have this whole, you know, community of doctors who are coming out online that are saying, actually, plants have these anti nutrients, plants are bad for you, so you should avoid them when in fact, every major study we have hundreds of studies with hundreds of actually millions of people.

00:32:27:00 – 00:33:02:22
Nathan Crane
The more plants you have in your diet, the healthier you are long term, the less cancer you have, less all cause mortality, less diabetes, etc.. And that in a mechanism where, yeah, maybe, you know, there’s, there’s so-called anti nutrient, it might bind to a little bit of calcium from the plants or whatever. But when you’re getting a diverse variety of different plant foods that are filled with these antioxidants, these polyphenols, these phytonutrients, that the total collective benefit is significantly higher and greater than what might be considers as tiny, you know, detrimental mechanism.

00:33:02:24 – 00:33:25:11
Nathan Crane
Right. And that’s why we can’t mix up mechanistic studies with outcome studies, which is what a lot of these carnivore doctors online are doing right now and saying, oh, plants are all bad for you because they bind to some minerals and have some outside nutrients. So yeah, but all the studies actually show us the opposite of that. And I think that’s important because there’s so much misinformation online now that’s confusing the crap out of people.

00:33:27:00 – 00:33:45:18
Dr. Dan Rubin
You know, and I’m not aware of that information, but I find that utterly ridiculous. I can’t understand the scientific mechanism. All I have to do is open these blinds. It’s going to be 90 here today and it’s what, April 12th or something? And the sun is shining down. So that’s what I often do with patients. I say, look out there.

00:33:46:08 – 00:34:03:05
Dr. Dan Rubin
You know that if you sit in the sun, you’re going to and you don’t go inside, you’re going to get pretty sunburn, it’s going to be bad. And you could develop cancer from what if why doesn’t this tree why does it all day sit in the sun? What is it doing? It’s producing antioxidants to fight the photonic energy we can.

00:34:03:12 – 00:34:17:13
Dr. Dan Rubin
I mean, photonic energy is radiation therapy to photonic energy, just like from the sun. That’s why there’s a light dark. I mean, there’s a reason that we, you know, cover up and need to protect ourselves.

00:34:17:13 – 00:34:41:19
Nathan Crane
Not to mention not to mention a hormone that’s synthesized in the body we all know as vitamin D, where, in fact, studies have shown upwards of 60% of people around the world are actually deficient in vitamin D. And, you know, talking about the sun, I love that you bring that up because people think that all I have I know people who avoid the sun at all costs because they don’t want their skin to age or they don’t want skin cancer.

00:34:42:08 – 00:35:19:02
Nathan Crane
But in fact, that sun, as you’re saying, is not only so essential to get that photonic energy through the foods that we’re eating, but also to actually synthesize the vitamin D in our bodies, which we know is essential for up regulating the immune system and fighting against cancer. So clearly, you don’t want to be in the sun 8 hours a day and be sunburned all day, every day, but, you know, 20 minutes, 30 minutes up to an hour of sunshine most days, certainly if you’re in areas where, you know, areas on the planet where you can actually get enough, you know, if you’re up in Alaska, it’s very difficult.

00:35:19:14 – 00:35:39:22
Nathan Crane
But, you know, and you may have to take a supplement, but that vitamin D is just it’s so essential. I literally was outside having a meeting outside today, 30 minutes in the sunshine effort, foot on the earth, you know, absorbing those electrons from the earth, which are also natural antioxidants. You know, not too long ago, people like, oh, this is old hippie nonsense.

00:35:39:22 – 00:35:50:23
Nathan Crane
And even though I feel like a hippie at heart, I love digging into and understanding the science behind what’s actually happening with connecting to nature and is powerful.

00:35:51:12 – 00:36:17:10
Dr. Dan Rubin
So that’s exactly what I was referring to about how we were laughed and scoffed at. And when you are intelligent and thinking and you understand how to treat a human body and you are aware of what happens when you put certain drinks in your body and how you feel and you understand, you know, what’s happening when you’re eating, then, you know, science kind of corrupts that and kind of gets in the way.

00:36:18:00 – 00:36:38:19
Dr. Dan Rubin
Just like you were saying, if I take it sometimes I need an extract of a plant to shut down a certain mechanism, right? Like I may need a GALECTIN three inhibitor and we should probably let’s talk about especially when we talk about inflammation because the lectern three is an unsung inflammatory and that people are starting to really become aware about.

00:36:38:19 – 00:37:02:17
Dr. Dan Rubin
We’ve been testing this in our clinic and using anti collecting three agents for years but and now it’s a drug target. But I want to talk about this as soon as I’m done. The idea would be is then that’s an extract of a plant. But we know, like you said, there’s an intelligence of plants. And I’ll tell you, I know plants are intelligent because I used to do banjos and I had a ginkgo Bonzo that developed a fungal infection.

00:37:03:06 – 00:37:24:20
Dr. Dan Rubin
And so I did acupuncture on it and I have a picture of it. And then single or two treatments, get rid of the fungal infection, right? So we can communicate using that kind of stuff. So why wouldn’t you want to bring that energy in which they inhabit the same earth as us, the same place? So we all need the sun.

00:37:24:20 – 00:37:44:13
Dr. Dan Rubin
It’s just understanding. And so to hear that you should eat plants, I that to me sounds like you could develop cancer from just eating meat. Actually, there’s a personal story of somebody that I know that that it wasn’t cancer, but it was something else debilitating that happened when they went on an army dig. I don’t know. We could probably talk about that.

00:37:44:13 – 00:38:04:13
Dr. Dan Rubin
But you asked me to talk about inflammation. So Galectin three is a molecule in the body. It is a it is a lectern. And I’m guessing that the carnivores are saying that plants have lectins that negatively interact with your body and you shouldn’t eat them and you got to be careful. And there’s doctors out there who talk about like the analogy, etc..

00:38:04:13 – 00:38:23:14
Dr. Dan Rubin
We that’s where the whole eat right for your blood type. And I was around when that developed because it’s naturopathic doctors who developed that and I’m down with lectin ology like that makes sense, right? Because we have red blood cells and we have receptors on our cells. It inter interact with lectins. The issue is is that a galectin?

00:38:23:14 – 00:38:51:14
Dr. Dan Rubin
So a type of lectin I’m sorry, molecule in your body is called the lectin and the lectern has a role to play. It has a housekeeping role, but through inflammatory means or through overstimulation, you can get an upregulation of galectin three intellect and three can really play a negative role. It’s a pro fibrotic agent. It can be a pro cancer agent, and I can go through the mechanisms of that.

00:38:51:24 – 00:39:24:15
Dr. Dan Rubin
And the only to my knowledge known GALECTIN three inhibitor comes out of the pith of the citrus fruit. The inside the soup that we don’t eat. And you know, I test galectin three and it’s amazing how many people have non optimal levels of Galectin three in their body. And I know I don’t know any other doctors. I mean this, you know, the whole thing was developed by Dr. Isaac Elias back in the day when he had such forward thinking and was really putting forth, you know, optimal levels, not using the, you know, the standard level.

00:39:24:15 – 00:39:48:24
Dr. Dan Rubin
And we could talk about what comes on lab tests, and I’m happy to indulge. But this is a need to be known molecule. If there’s physicians listening, I’m going to encourage you to start measuring Galectin three. You’re commercial labs do it. It’s really well known in cardiac remodeling after myocardial infarction. That means after heart attack, you have part of your heart that either dies off or doesn’t get oxygen.

00:39:48:24 – 00:40:11:16
Dr. Dan Rubin
And so the higher your galectin three after a heart attack, the worse your heart recovers. It gets recovers, gets more stiff and a stiff heart doesn’t work. Well, you don’t want that. So imagine and that’s just one set of data. And when you get, you know, your lab test back, it gives you results in terms of cardiac remodeling.

00:40:11:16 – 00:40:36:06
Dr. Dan Rubin
But in cancer, it’s a huge target. And so what these companies do is they take the path of these citrus fruits and they take the pectin out of there and they modify it into an absorbable interactive way so that it can interact with the Galectin three. Neutralize it so it can’t have the negative effects on your body might still be there, but it’s not having the negative effect.

00:40:36:12 – 00:41:08:11
Dr. Dan Rubin
And fibrosis in human health is incredible. I don’t know how often you get you talk about fibrosis on your podcast or but that is if you don’t talk about, well, I would probably talk about it because fibrosis is getting old. Fibrosis is scarring in the body and fibrosis happened. It’s a huge player in the oncology world. The more fibrosis we have, the less your immune system can get in, the more connective tissue your molecules have to go through to get delivered to the to the target area.

00:41:08:11 – 00:41:30:18
Dr. Dan Rubin
The less chemotherapy could work, the less oxygen penetrant you can have. So radiation doesn’t work. Surgery might be more difficult because you have too many adhesions. Drug delivery, the bigger the molecule, the harder it might be to squeeze through some of these some of these areas, and especially if you have smaller vasculature that you need to deliver medicines, even nutrients fit the larger the molecule, the smaller the space.

00:41:31:00 – 00:41:52:03
Dr. Dan Rubin
I mean, if you can’t get a molecule through, you’re certainly not going to get a white blood cell over there. So that talks about why inflammation, especially from the fibrotic perspective. And there’s a whole repertoire of tests that we’ll use on panels that are cohorts with galectin three, but we only know of one GALECTIN three inhibitor and a true one, and that’s the small one and that’s the practice.

00:41:52:03 – 00:42:07:21
Dr. Dan Rubin
So that’s available on the market. It’s the only one that, to my knowledge, has been studied. That’s the only one that, to my knowledge is the only one we use in our clinic. And it’s I mean, I took it this morning, but a lot of my patients will measure. They’re collecting three. They’re going through active treatment. They get better.

00:42:08:08 – 00:42:24:09
Dr. Dan Rubin
They’re collecting three sort of goes down. And I’m like, you know, if you want to lessen your burden, you know, this is one that maybe you could be done with. And they’re like, can I just keep taking it? I feel really good when I take it. I like the mechanism. I like what it does, I like the taste, and I’m like, Yeah, it’s not toxic and why not?

00:42:24:09 – 00:42:28:02
Dr. Dan Rubin
As they age? And so yeah. So go ahead.

00:42:28:02 – 00:42:44:04
Nathan Crane
Yeah. No, I want to dove into that deeper. I mean, I personally use practice all as well. Dr. Isaac Elias is a good friend of mine. He’s he’s in my holistic Leadership Council. I actually just spent last weekend with him down in Playa del Carmen discussing a lot of these topics. Yeah, it was incredible. And I mean. I mean what?

00:42:44:10 – 00:43:08:18
Nathan Crane
I mean. Yeah, what a revolutionary doctor. Right. And scientists and discovery, you know, really helping bring this work forward. And and, you know, you’re continuing this work forward, which is incredible. And I think, you know, to translate for people a little bit and, you know, correct. Anything that I say, if anything I say is wrong because, you know, I’ve just recently learned about Galectin three in the last couple of years and have been diving into the research.

00:43:08:18 – 00:43:23:01
Nathan Crane
And what I’ve come to learn so far basically, and why it is important for people and my my, you know, analysis of this is, you know, Galectin three is that upstream molecule, which in fact is a protein, right? Isn’t a protein.

00:43:25:13 – 00:43:25:23
Dr. Dan Rubin
Selected?

00:43:25:23 – 00:43:29:07
Nathan Crane
Three Yeah. Isn’t Galectin three a protein pernicious?

00:43:29:07 – 00:43:32:02
Dr. Dan Rubin
But it has a lot of residues galactose to date.

00:43:32:04 – 00:44:00:20
Nathan Crane
Yeah. So basically it’s an upstream molecule that actually triggers the release of a lot of the inflammatory cytokines in the body. Right. It’s before the interleukins as before these inflammatory cytokines. And so, you know, when you’re going after the inflammatory cytokines, you’re actually late in the process, which is why dissolve from the studies I’ve seen work so well because it actually goes upstream to Galectin three, which is kind of the trigger of it.

00:44:01:05 – 00:44:42:04
Nathan Crane
And why are we having so many of these inflammatory cytokines being released right? Like Galectin three is not like I wouldn’t look at it like, hey, that’s the enemy. But because of our diet and lifestyle, we have excessive amounts of Galectin three being released, which means we have excessive amounts of inflammatory cytokines being released, which means we’re contributing to this in that chronic inflammatory state in the body, which is damaging tissues and organs, which is leading to fibrosis and all this, you know, scarring, which is, you know, contributing towards diseases like cancer and others, you know, heart disease and so forth, showing up in the body.

00:44:42:08 – 00:45:07:07
Nathan Crane
Right. So because diet and lifestyle, toxins, you know, alcohol and cigarets and all these things that are chronically inflaming the body, we have way too much of this inflammatory, free state. And so by using something like a modified citrus pectin, you actually stop the upstream molecule of Galectin three and help reduce that inflammatory state in the body. Is that an accurate way to describe it?

00:45:07:09 – 00:45:09:22
Dr. Dan Rubin
Yeah, I would say we would regulate the lectern three.

00:45:10:05 – 00:45:15:09
Nathan Crane
Right? Yeah. It doesn’t fully stop it. It like regulates it, reduces it. Is that right.

00:45:15:22 – 00:45:40:04
Dr. Dan Rubin
Yeah. And modify in neutralizes. Well it depends what your level is. Right. If so, Dr. lies that kinship with him as well. We’ve talked much about this and so our particular lab, anything under 22.2 is considered normal. But to you know Dr. Ly is we’ve always held the optimal and that’s a lab core value. We want you at 13 or under.

00:45:40:12 – 00:46:00:18
Dr. Dan Rubin
It’s the same thing for insulin. Insulin, they change their values. You know, we used to have like an insane value of 15, but we now have an insulin value. Anything under 24.9 is considered normal, but not in my clinic. I want to definitely under 13 or below or try immuno regulated under ten. So it’s galectin three, you have to dose appropriately.

00:46:00:18 – 00:46:17:09
Dr. Dan Rubin
I mean if somebody has a 9.3 and that’s what we can recover in the blood, you also have to think if they have active tumor burden, you have to think about what’s going on in the tumor microenvironment too. So we may treat somebody with the Galectin three of 9.3, but we’re definitely going to treat somebody who’s above 13 and certainly people who are above the 22.2.

00:46:17:09 – 00:46:53:17
Dr. Dan Rubin
And we’re going to be regulating dosages. And some people, I think genetic early like we had talked about, there’s what we call a custodial or constituent level of Galectin three that, you know, kind of swims around and does its thing and communicates and it helps protect and it help, you know, but when you’re living up here with the Galectin three because you’re stressed out or there’s something that’s really aggravating you, or maybe you just your galectin three, which is easier to turn on than somebody else’s, which is, I don’t know of any genes being looked at for Galectin three, but I certainly it in my patients that we treat them for all of the above,

00:46:53:23 – 00:47:16:14
Dr. Dan Rubin
but they still might have a higher than optimal galectin three level or higher than 22.2 collected entry level. And why is that so? And I have that with other markers that we use interleukin six, VEGF, interleukin eight. You know, we’ve developed this lab profile over years, the fibrinogen. You know, we were the first ones to use this stuff and really bring it forward and teach lab evaluation.

00:47:16:14 – 00:47:34:23
Dr. Dan Rubin
Now, a lot of people have really developed that into their practice, which is great because you can really we can talk about this too. In my practice I say, you know, smell smoke in the basement. You know, people are coming to me because they don’t want to see cancer on their skin again. And I can read their blood values.

00:47:34:23 – 00:48:12:12
Dr. Dan Rubin
And if I smell smoke, I’m going to change their treatment or I’m going to treat them more heavily or turn up the volume on something. So I’m constantly looking at these values and reading through them and have become expert at, you know, the biophysical analysis of sorry bio physiological analysis through multiple levels of lab testing, which is what hearkens back to what you were talking about about once you’ve been through it, you don’t want to go through it again and or you can maintain control because by watching certain lab values, you can begin to understand certain cues about what you would consider the tumor microenvironment or the bio physiological balance or the behavior of the

00:48:12:12 – 00:48:25:04
Dr. Dan Rubin
body in response to maybe there’s existing tumors there that are just quiescent and they’re under control and so hence the importance of lab values. And like you said, Galectin three is at the top and sort of a master switch for inflammation.

00:48:25:11 – 00:48:31:02
Nathan Crane
Can you talk about some of the clinical data specifically related to cancer?

00:48:32:04 – 00:48:49:05
Dr. Dan Rubin
Oh, my God. Yeah. I mean, there was just a recent publication of a great trial with people with prostate cancer look at like true data, like you’re asking about not just, oh, we know the mechanism. And so we’re going to take structure and function and move it together. You’re talking about actually published data. So it was like a two step process, right?

00:48:49:16 – 00:49:15:14
Dr. Dan Rubin
Initially, the there was 49 people with prostate cancer, different Gleason grades, different situations, and they took practice all for six months. And they watched their PSA, they watched their scans, they watched what’s called PSA, doubling time. And those who had those who there was success. And so out of those 49 participants, they offered them another 12 months of treatment.

00:49:15:20 – 00:49:34:12
Dr. Dan Rubin
And this is the study I want to talk about, because it’s totally cool. Seven people decided they didn’t want to stay in the study because with the study you had to travel to a certain location to get monitored. So they just stayed on the supplement themselves, bought themselves 39 patients, stayed on it and they took it for another 12 months.

00:49:34:12 – 00:49:41:13
Dr. Dan Rubin
They were taken 4.8 grams three times a day. It’s not that hard to do and not everybody needs it three times a day. That was, the study.

00:49:41:22 – 00:49:48:15
Nathan Crane
Says, basic 15, 15 grams a day. So it’s for about five, about five grams three times a day, roughly, is what you’re saying.

00:49:49:01 – 00:50:17:10
Dr. Dan Rubin
In total easy to take. And these are gentlemen with prostate cancer and these are some people who have aggressive prostate cancer, actually 20. I don’t. GLEASON Great is a way to determine the aggressiveness of the prostate cancer. And so basically you’re looking at people with a combined Gleason grade of six, seven, eight, nine or ten, ten being the most aggressive, much more difficult to treat.

00:50:17:10 – 00:50:52:18
Dr. Dan Rubin
I believe 21% of these patients in this study actually had Gleason grade eight through ten, which means that one of the cohorts had aggressive disease. All of these patients were had prior treatment. They either had surgery, they had radiation, or they had surgery and radiation. And 38% of them had actually had hormone therapy before. So they were pretreated and all of them had what’s called biochemically relapsed prostate cancer, which means the PSA, the marker that you use to watch should be maximally suppressed.

00:50:53:07 – 00:51:16:17
Dr. Dan Rubin
And then it wasn’t. It started to go up, which means that there’s prostate cancer lurking somewhere in your body. So that’s called biochemical relapse, meaning you see it biochemically, but you don’t necessarily see it on the scan. And then what? They did it, they took the practice out and they looked at over a 12 month period, did the PSA go down?

00:51:17:13 – 00:51:38:01
Dr. Dan Rubin
Did it stabilize or did it increase? And what happened with what’s called the PSA doubling time. So if a PSA was one and then it goes to two, that’s a doubling time. And then what would it take to go to four? These are high. So we’re usually talking about something, you know, in the test. So maybe 0.2 goes to 0.4.

00:51:38:05 – 00:52:01:11
Dr. Dan Rubin
That’s still a doubling time and that’s still absolutely important relative. And usually it’s very important so they looked at also not just PSA but did people have lengthening of the doubling time. Right. Which you want you don’t want a shortening. And then they also looked at scans to people at the end of the study, have a scan that was positive or was it negative?

00:52:01:20 – 00:52:34:19
Dr. Dan Rubin
And there was an 85% overall response rate, 85% response rate. 90% of those people actually had a lengthening of their PSA, doubling time, meaning that it took longer for the PSA to go up. But there was only 10% of people who didn’t respond like that, and 90% of people maintained a negative scan. People had a positive scan. You’re going to have some like that, especially in the higher Gleason grades.

00:52:35:13 – 00:52:51:09
Dr. Dan Rubin
These are pretreated people. That’s that’s astonishing data for a well-tolerated easy to obtain good tasting highly effective well-studied nutritional supplement that people can get right now after this podcast.

00:52:52:08 – 00:52:53:22
Nathan Crane
Yeah, that’s pretty amazing.

00:52:53:24 – 00:52:55:12
Dr. Dan Rubin
I was a study of prostate cancer.

00:52:56:13 – 00:53:25:06
Nathan Crane
That’s I mean, it’s pretty incredible. And it still blows my mind. I think it still blows my mind that you can have prostate cancer, you can have the prostate removed, and the prostate cancer can still come back. Right? And your PSA levels can increase like that. I just I met with a client the other day who had the exact same scenario happen and it still blows my mind.

00:53:25:06 – 00:53:42:15
Nathan Crane
And then, you know, you have something like this that can really help the body regulate itself against that inflammatory mechanism that’s basically happening in the body. So what else have you seen clinically with your cancer patients of maybe different types of cancer and using practice?

00:53:42:15 – 00:54:01:03
Dr. Dan Rubin
So it’s a great question. Thank you. Actually, I want to go back to what you just said about the amazement where you can have your total prostatectomy prostates removed and then there’s still prostate cancer cells living in the body and then they can recur. That is not uncommon in other types of cancer. It’s one of the great aggravations that I’ve had in my career.

00:54:01:20 – 00:54:40:14
Dr. Dan Rubin
And sometimes, you know, there used to be less reliance on MRI’s pre prostatectomy and people didn’t, they’d say like oh you know there there was some extra prostatic extension into the tissues. Well watch your PSA, you might require radiation after surgery. You know, if the PSA goes up, the problem is, is even if you have a positive margin, meaning there is a chance that cancer was left behind in the surgery despite it being a great surgery, that doesn’t mean that that cancer is going to stay local to that area and like you said, cancer can directly invader, cancer can metastasize to roots spread.

00:54:41:14 – 00:55:10:11
Dr. Dan Rubin
And I always tell my patients metastasis is when you gain access to the blood or the lymphatic system and you can go on a ride and you can, you know, spread throughout the body. And direct invasion is when you sort of just grind into the tissues and, you know, grow there. The metastatic process is entirely important because even if that patient who had biochemical recurrence and even if they did, I said, you know, our best step is conventionally our best next step would be for us to do radiation in the prostate bed.

00:55:10:21 – 00:55:28:07
Dr. Dan Rubin
They get radiation, maybe they have erectile dysfunction, maybe they have pelvic problems, and maybe they even get radiation, which we need to talk about. I need to circle back on this. Regarding practice, I’ll cell C because I know of nothing else that’s going to help prevent that. And this is a message to all men out there who are either getting or got radiation therapy.

00:55:29:01 – 00:55:52:14
Dr. Dan Rubin
And I want to talk about our experience with that. But that doesn’t mean if they get the radiation that there isn’t cancer cells spreading in the body. And why not do a simple Medicare covered, insurance covered, circulating tumor cell test radio in the United States? You can it. We’ve been doing it for years. We’ve looked at that. It’s data driven right now into circulating tumor DNA.

00:55:52:14 – 00:56:20:11
Dr. Dan Rubin
You don’t have to just watch PSA. There’s so many ways to use our lab profile. I mean, this is 2024. We have ways to monitor. But one of the molecules that interacts with the cancer cell and may encourage metastatic spread is Galectin three. So from a preventative standpoint, people with cancer that are at risk for recurrence distantly and recurrence recurrence is kind of a misnomer if it recurs.

00:56:20:11 – 00:56:27:24
Dr. Dan Rubin
It never really went away in the first place. It just showed up somewhere else. So I’m trying to kind of get away, but it’s a colloquial colloquialism that.

00:56:27:24 – 00:56:50:14
Nathan Crane
Well, it’s it’s true, though, because those cancer stem cells, we know I mean, this is peer reviewed in the literature. We know that chemotherapy and radiation don’t actually kill cancer stem cells. So we can get rid of the tumor. We can, you know, reduce the tumor burden. You know, we can really even get to a sign of no evidence of disease, but we don’t do anything about the cancer stem cells.

00:56:50:14 – 00:57:10:17
Nathan Crane
It’s very possible that they’re still there circulating through the body. The CTC, you just talked about circulating tumor cells, for example, the stem cells specifically if the environment doesn’t change in which allowed the cancer to form in the body, then those stem cells are basically, you know, the mother cells that are going to help new cancers form and metastasize.

00:57:10:17 – 00:57:20:13
Nathan Crane
And then that’s what we would call a recurrence rate. Right, which is really, like you said, the cancer actually never really left. We had those stem cells there that were just ready to take root.

00:57:21:04 – 00:57:40:20
Dr. Dan Rubin
You know, I’m right there with you. We’ve developed formulas in our clinic that are targeted towards the cancer stem cells. When we were able to look at EMT transform of care to negative ctcs, we developed a whole stem cell platform. That lab test isn’t available anymore, and I really wish that a lab would let us see the but we those cells.

00:57:40:20 – 00:57:58:08
Dr. Dan Rubin
But we used to look for cancer stem cells in the blood right there with you on that. We do a lot of lab testing around that. We do a lot of treatment around that. Galectin three is a player there, but like renal cell carcinoma. You asked me about other cancers. Renal cell carcinoma surgery is the primary option, but we see a lot of down the line years later.

00:57:58:08 – 00:58:18:03
Dr. Dan Rubin
People may have a lesion in their lung and it might just be that they’re not screened well enough to be able to target that lesion when it’s small and there’s local treatment you can do. You know, renal cell doesn’t respond to traditional chemotherapy and radiation response. Immunotherapeutic Lee and so we’ve over the years, we’ve done a lot of work, you know, with people with renal cell carcinoma.

00:58:18:11 – 00:58:48:22
Dr. Dan Rubin
That’s one of those where after surgery people need to be monitored, screened, in my opinion. But we see Galectin three in those typical sort of like you said earlier in the podcast, almost diseases, cancers of lifestyle, a colorectal disease, some lung cancers. I mean, it really depends upon the person too. And with the bio physiological phenomena are in that person, especially if you can lab them up while they have disease burden.

00:58:49:04 – 00:59:22:11
Dr. Dan Rubin
So if I see him post-surgery, I never know what their bio physiology like pre-surgery. So now that we’re able to get the word out more, we’re seeing more and more people sort of right at diagnosis or right when they had a colonoscopy or something. So we can really get a feel, take them to treatment and then say, okay, now we have a way to screen you for years and if we ever see your interleukin eight go up or your interleukin six, you know, go up with your MMP nine, and if we see a little snickering of Sarala Pleasant or, you know, whatever it is, the profile for that patient or maybe it’s an organic acid

00:59:22:11 – 00:59:46:05
Dr. Dan Rubin
test and there’s a particular marker, maybe it’s a stool test, maybe it’s a micronutrient profile, but you know, really, really monitoring these people, especially years later. That’s where that’s really one of the most beautiful and elegant places for a doctor like myself, because there’s a gargantuan one in L.A. Pathak medicine. That’s a unrealized gap. They don’t even see the gap.

00:59:47:23 – 01:00:13:12
Dr. Dan Rubin
We see the gap. And that’s really it’s a big part of where we come in. A lot of people think like, oh, you know, can you just, you know, kind of get me through and make the chemotherapy easier, get me through radiation, etc.. It’s like life after cancer. And so I wanted to get back to radiation practice because that’s something where I think we can be really, really influential with the practice of I don’t know anybody else who talks about this.

01:00:13:12 – 01:00:45:12
Dr. Dan Rubin
This was just kind of one of our findings because we used to have clinics in different radiation oncology clinics in the valley here. And there are men who even several months to a year down the line after radiation therapy for prostate cancer, can develop a severe inflammation of the rectum called radiation practice. And it’s problematic. And if the end result of that is fibrosis of the rectum, that could be really problematic.

01:00:45:12 – 01:01:04:08
Dr. Dan Rubin
If you want your rectum to be nice and you know the muscle, you don’t want it to be hard. When stool comes. I mean, it’s uncomfortable. So that’s a primary reason why I like to use practice. So when people are going through radiation therapy, that’s not a prescription. That’s not me telling a patient to do it. That’s me saying what I do for my patients when I prescribe it.

01:01:04:17 – 01:01:19:17
Dr. Dan Rubin
But if you’re somebody going to radiation therapy, you should ask your doctor about this. And if you’re somebody with prostate cancer and you fit into that cohort, you should. This is data driven. What we talked about, bring it to your urologist. It’s peer reviewed literature.

01:01:19:17 – 01:01:44:07
Nathan Crane
It’s undeniable when you measure inflammatory markers in patients, whether it’s interleukins, whatever other inflammatory, maybe even hs-crp, for example. And then you and then you measure Galectin three. Do you always at least yourself, do you always see if these inflammatory markers are elevated that Galectin three is always going to be elevated as well?

01:01:44:22 – 01:02:06:04
Dr. Dan Rubin
That we don’t? And it’s a great question, and that’s where the skill comes in to reading, because I could have a panel and all of those that you mentioned, you know, with all of the markers that are sort of downstream, the upstream, the downstream, in the middle and say, I do 23 lab tests on somebody. That’s one result to me because I’m going to look at that and oftentimes pick up.

01:02:06:09 – 01:02:27:24
Dr. Dan Rubin
I have a certain method of how I go through this. And if any of my patients are listening, we’re like, Yeah, that’s not true. But we go through and we we chart out all the labs and I make little comments and I do my thing. And then I give them a summary. And so all of those could be normal, but they’re still abnormal in my head because I can see the picture and you can see the biochemical interrelatedness.

01:02:27:24 – 01:02:50:12
Dr. Dan Rubin
And so just because somebody might have a nature CRP of 0.9 and normals under one and their fibrinogen antigen may be high, but it may be, you know, I have my levels right if normal is up to 504, I wanted a certain rate. If I’m doing like a normal up to 400, I want them under 350. But they’re all there’s also the ratios of how they interact with each other and that’s where we try and sniff stuff out.

01:02:50:20 – 01:03:09:14
Dr. Dan Rubin
That’s the smoke in the basement. That’s how we develop our protocols. When we’re looking at it bio physiologically, then you start bringing the other physiological tests. Now you got a greater picture of people, and it’s something we call grand planning where you amalgamate all these labs, talk to the symptom overview, and then you use your substances and your lifestyle.

01:03:09:14 – 01:03:27:00
Dr. Dan Rubin
And you know, for some people, maybe it’s EMDR therapy and for some people maybe it’s frequency specific. Microcurrent like you said, maybe it’s rt-cgm, maybe it’s pure supplements. Maybe I need to put them on IV therapy. You know, it depends. What’s more, you know, maybe they just need to be in the sun or they need to, you know, take a vacation or something.

01:03:27:00 – 01:03:43:08
Dr. Dan Rubin
And then we do labs, so we do a lot of that. But the answer to question is no. I don’t always see elected three being above 13 when there is an inflammation and maybe that’s because of their genetics, maybe they’re doing something to control the Galectin three. But downstream it’s not as well controlled.

01:03:44:07 – 01:04:00:23
Nathan Crane
Yeah. I wonder if that does galectin three stay elevated after it’s kind of done its its job of like activating these other inflammatory markers and is that what could have caused it to come down possibly. Do you know about that. I’m just theorizing. I don’t know.

01:04:01:08 – 01:04:14:22
Dr. Dan Rubin
Yeah, maybe you’re treating it or maybe that’s which is it really one that stays on. But once you flip down a downstream switch, that one’s harder to turn off. And even if you turn off galectin three, the lights still stay on in the other room. So to speak.

01:04:14:22 – 01:04:19:11
Nathan Crane
What percentage of Galectin three is elevated in your patients, would you say roughly.

01:04:20:10 – 01:04:24:15
Dr. Dan Rubin
Overall, 65 to 70%.

01:04:24:24 – 01:04:26:23
Nathan Crane
It’s a pretty, pretty high number.

01:04:27:15 – 01:04:39:21
Dr. Dan Rubin
And granted, some of these people, I’m not testing on it. So those are of the tested population. Some, you know, we can’t so we can’t order through their insurance or through Medicare and so they opt out of testing.

01:04:40:06 – 01:05:02:19
Nathan Crane
Now, just in general, is like I’m an athlete, I tear my body down a lot, right? I take practice. I’ll just in general is kind of like a preventative measure, if you will, you know, helping keep Galectin three, you know, at a healthy level, like for general population or people who want to stay healthy or even potentially prevent chronic disease down the road.

01:05:02:22 – 01:05:07:03
Nathan Crane
You know, would you say practicing is a good option for people called it.

01:05:07:09 – 01:05:36:03
Dr. Dan Rubin
It’s why we’re taking it. You call that I that’s why it’s kind of like a gift, you know, to inhibit Galectin three it’s part of that healthy aging. And that’s a big thing right now in regenerative medicine. I mean, I’m sure I’m guessing it’s a part of regenerative medicine protocols, if not something to really look into, because then you would need less medicine if you can prevent in the first place, especially like you said, I really think my exercise recovery is improved from a dose of practice.

01:05:36:03 – 01:05:38:04
Dr. Dan Rubin
I’ll see whether it’s once a day or twice a day.

01:05:39:06 – 01:05:39:16
Nathan Crane
Yeah.

01:05:39:22 – 01:05:43:02
Dr. Dan Rubin
And feels good to have in my body.

01:05:43:24 – 01:06:01:20
Nathan Crane
Right, right. And you know, once I learn about this, you know, I’ve been I’ve been recommending it to our community over the last couple of years just because it was like to me, I look at the science, interviewed Dr. Isaac Elias a while back and I’ve been sharing it because I’m just like, this is this is a no brainer.

01:06:01:20 – 01:06:22:03
Nathan Crane
You know, you have something that is simple and easy, affordable, easier to I take capsules, but you can take the powders you know, and all the science behind it is like I’ve never seen an ingredient or a supplement out there that has as much science as this does behind it on safety and efficacy.

01:06:22:03 – 01:06:24:21
Dr. Dan Rubin
So where do you take the capsules over the powder?

01:06:25:03 – 01:06:36:09
Nathan Crane
I don’t know. I don’t think it’s a preference, but I just think I’ve gotten the capsules. I’ve just gotten used to it. But you like the powder better.

01:06:38:01 – 01:06:53:22
Dr. Dan Rubin
I just always thought, you know, in the world of oncology, you were given people so many capsules that it’s sometimes a nice break and it’s just think it’s a refreshing drink. You know, that line flavor when he finally, you know, dialed that in, he was just like, all right.

01:06:54:03 – 01:07:10:13
Nathan Crane
I’ll have to get some powder because I don’t take that many capsules anymore. So for me, it’s not that big of a deal. Like, I’ll take a multivitamin, I’ll take, you know, some omegas, some algae oil. Like, a lot of the things I take is either liquid or tincture based. I just don’t take a lot of capsules anymore.

01:07:10:13 – 01:07:33:11
Nathan Crane
So like, you know, taking some capsules each day with the packs, I was like not a big deal for me if, if you’re, you know, on a really regimented, you know, nutritional, you know, supplement supplemental protocol with cancer, as I know many of the clients we work with and you know, they work with their integrative oncologist who have them on like 20 or 30 different supplements at different times and hundreds of pills.

01:07:33:11 – 01:08:09:00
Nathan Crane
Like, I get it. Yeah. Reducing the amount of capsules is a big deal. So for me, it’s not personally not not really a big deal at the moment, but I don’t think I’ve even tried the powder, so I’m going to have to get some and try it out and see what I think. And so, by the way, I want to let our community know who’s who’s tuning in on this right now is, you know, we’ve actually spoken with the company produces back to salt you can eugenics and they’ve provided a mega discount for you guys so you know if you’re interested in trying this for yourself and using it, you know, for your own personal

01:08:09:12 – 01:08:27:14
Nathan Crane
health reasons, we’ll put a link below my team. I’ll put a link below. There’s like a really special limited time discount they’ve put together you. I actually don’t even know all the details on that. I’m not really in the that side of things. I’m just into the research and education and sharing what I find and use with myself, with all of you.

01:08:27:23 – 01:08:54:18
Nathan Crane
So, you know, if you want to take advantage of that really special limited time discount for you guys to get picked to sell for yourself, click the link below and go and check that out for yourself. I highly recommend that personally have been using it for my own health and prevention really and helping me, you know as you said, it’s, you know, regenerative medicine from a regenerative medicine approach, from a anti-aging approach, from a longevity approach.

01:08:54:24 – 01:09:19:07
Nathan Crane
But I know lot of our community is dealing with chronic diseases like cancer. And so being able to have high quality evidence based solutions that have strong science behind them is really important because there’s a lot and you mentioned this, Dr. Rubin, there’s a lot of stuff out there on social media now, a lot of claims being made, you know, a lot of cure alls and, you know, this and that.

01:09:19:07 – 01:09:39:09
Nathan Crane
And I’m really careful not to say certain thing. And, you know, I’m not bound by any board. I’m bound by my own ethics and integrity to say, look, here’s what the science says. Here’s what the case studies are showing. Here’s the anecdotes, you know, but you got to make a decision for yourself in your own health. I’m never going to claim something is a cure.

01:09:39:09 – 01:09:57:17
Nathan Crane
All are going to, you know, you know, treat you and get rid of your cancer. This, that, that’s just it’s irresponsible, you know? And so I don’t even do that. But when I find something that is truly backed by tremendous amount of science, that’s backed by, you know, people in a company really cares about people and it’s working.

01:09:57:17 – 01:10:13:05
Nathan Crane
And I see it working in myself and hearing it working in other patients. And then I get behind it and say, Absolutely, I recommend this. I think it’s it’s very high quality and can be very beneficial to you. So this is one of those rare products that I personally do get behind and recommend.

01:10:13:20 – 01:10:14:11
Dr. Dan Rubin
Yeah.

01:10:14:11 – 01:10:37:12
Nathan Crane
And take and personally take. Absolutely. So actually, I actually now’s a perfect time. I literally took my last capsules this morning and again, I’m going to get some powder now. Yeah, I’m glad. I’m glad we spoke today. It’s good timing. If you have a few more minutes, I want to talk with you about a couple of other things.

01:10:37:12 – 01:10:41:22
Nathan Crane
I’m guessing you’re familiar with a lot of Wahlberg’s work in the early 1900s.

01:10:43:07 – 01:10:45:09
Dr. Dan Rubin
On mitochondria and Krebs and. Yeah.

01:10:46:05 – 01:11:22:23
Nathan Crane
Yeah, yeah. Are you, are you pretty much in alignment with, you know, cancer primarily being a mitochondria, a metabolic disease, a mitochondrial dysfunctional disease. It basically damaged what that research really showed. And what the continuation of that research from other scientists and doctors over the last 80 plus years has gone on to actually in multiple laboratories, is that, you know, cancer is primarily dysfunction and degeneration and and and the destruction of the mitochondria in the cells which leads as cell to chronically ferment.

01:11:23:04 – 01:11:45:02
Nathan Crane
Right. Switching from oxidative to a robot glycolysis primarily getting a lot of its fuel source from glucose. Not primarily, but I mean, not totally, but but often. Primarily. And that cancer is really a disease of dysfunction of the mitochondria. Would you would you agree with that? Do you have a different stance on that? What do you think about that?

01:11:45:02 – 01:11:51:23
Dr. Dan Rubin
I think that the enormity of the box that you just opened is consequential. Yeah.

01:11:52:03 – 01:11:53:16
Nathan Crane
And that I at the least.

01:11:54:01 – 01:12:24:19
Dr. Dan Rubin
Yes. That I think that if I were to fully agree with that, that I would not be doing my patients a service because we’ve been around for that for so long. And I do enough testing on people’s mitochondria and have for years and there is enough emerging literature to say that oxidative phosphorylation is upregulated in certain cancer cell types, that if we focus on the mitochondria too much, you’re going to see progressive disease in people.

01:12:25:16 – 01:12:56:10
Dr. Dan Rubin
And so our test, the electron transport chain, I look at mitochondrial metabolites on organic acid testing, I amalgamate those with my other lab tests and I also look at symptoms. And I have to say that the answer to the question is primarily, but not exclusively. I have to look far beyond that because there is so much work and I appreciate the work that’s come out of on cancers and metabolic disease and what the doctors are doing out there.

01:12:57:22 – 01:13:30:06
Dr. Dan Rubin
But there are people who that is not true for. And I also I happen work probably 20% of my practice is pediatric oncology, which I’m guessing I don’t know if you get an opportunity to interview pediatric, but some of the true heroes in this world of pediatric oncologists, not me. I mean, the conventional is that they’re the people who who do this for children.

01:13:30:16 – 01:14:01:24
Dr. Dan Rubin
Yeah. True heroes. And the parents of these kids go through end imaginable strife. And that’s 20% of my practice. And I don’t know how their mitochondria are dysfunctional. If it’s a chronic disease of a lifetime. So this is a discussion that I’m having with, you know, a family regarding mitochondria in this and looking for certain things. So the answer is, yeah, there’s a lot of that primarily.

01:14:02:10 – 01:14:29:00
Dr. Dan Rubin
And obviously I moved by the courage and the sheer courage of that of that whole world of pediatric oncology and what that is. And it’s really become a bigger part of my of my practice only we interact now and there’s less it’s less scary to the conventional lists, you know, Phenix Children’s Hospital and I mean we’re there go to referral, go speak there pretty routinely.

01:14:29:00 – 01:14:38:10
Dr. Dan Rubin
I’ll be there in June. So I don’t know because I don’t know how their mitochondria then became so damaged unless that’s genomic.

01:14:39:03 – 01:14:41:13
Nathan Crane
Yeah. I mean the fact about that is.

01:14:42:15 – 01:15:07:14
Dr. Dan Rubin
Real DNA comes from there. So these are really deep questions. So that’s why for me and I am not in the camp of that is my only focus. But I know there are camps like that and I respect those camps and those are my colleagues and these are people who have done great work. I just in my practice, I think that it’s a it’s a there are times when I have to look around that.

01:15:08:05 – 01:15:30:14
Nathan Crane
Yeah, I hear you. I mean, the fact about, you know, pediatric oncologists, you know, being heroes in the family, I, you know, I’m a father of two kids. I had, you know, 13 year old and eight year old, eight year old son, 13 year old daughter. And, you know, seeing what these kids go through, I see videos on social media and see them going through, you know, chemotherapy and radiation and fighting for their lives and losing their hair.

01:15:30:14 – 01:15:49:10
Nathan Crane
And so, I mean, so much pain and sickness. I mean, I watched my own grandfather go through that, watched him pass away and that’s what got me into cancer research. And an education was was seeing what happened to him. But I mean, I can’t imagine as a father, you know, watching your children go through that like just how devastating and challenging that would be.

01:15:50:08 – 01:16:22:17
Nathan Crane
And so 100% in agreement with you on that and on on the mitochondrial aspect. What’s really sad, actually, and I just spent months preparing this heavily research back presentation I just gave to a group about 700 people live and then another, you know, thousands of people online, which is the what I what I call nine major categories of toxins that we’re exposed to that are contributing massively to the cancer proliferation.

01:16:22:23 – 01:16:43:22
Nathan Crane
Right. This massive increase of cancer diagnosis we’ve seen in the last 70 plus years where cancer was was significantly less in people than it is now. And we see an explosion in young people. Right. That study that just came out or if you’ve seen it, but people 50 and younger cancer the last 30 years has increased by upwards of 80%.

01:16:44:04 – 01:17:09:06
Nathan Crane
Right. Right. So younger people and in children, children are being diagnosed with higher rates of cancer now than ever before at 300, I believe, numbers, 300,000 kids around the world are being diagnosed from before. It was like children never had cancer. And so as I dove deep into the research into the toxins, we see that 140,000 manmade chemicals have been introduced and invented and many of them are carcinogenic.

01:17:09:06 – 01:17:46:18
Nathan Crane
They’re endocrine disruptors. And every what they all have in common, the ones that tend to be carcinogenic or endocrine disruptors, the ones that we we say, hey, these are causing chronic inflammation or damaging our endocrine system or damaging DNA. One, I found that every single one of these nine major categories of toxins, what they do at a cellular level, every single one of them damages the mitochondria and we know through the study that was done by the EWG, I think 15, 18 years ago that you know, how we used to think that the placenta, you know, protected the baby from the toxins that were inside the mother?

01:17:46:18 – 01:18:08:19
Nathan Crane
We know that’s not true, right? These 200 plus carcinogenic and endocrine disrupting chemicals are routinely found in the baby’s cord blood. So the umbilical cord, the chemicals which doctors used to think, oh, those don’t get passed into the baby, we now know they are. So people say, well, why did God diagnose my child with cancer? They were born with cancer.

01:18:09:00 – 01:18:35:23
Nathan Crane
Or in three years, five years later, they have cancer or autoimmune or other chronic inflammatory diseases. And I say, look, it wasn’t God. We know that the mother is being, you know, bombarded by this toxic world. It’s through the umbilical cord into the baby. And those toxins are damaging the baby at a cellular level, damaging DNA, creating reactive oxygen species and specific damaging and destroying the mitochondria of the cell.

01:18:36:16 – 01:19:04:02
Nathan Crane
So while this is, you know, and then I look at, you know, Thomas Siegfried’s work and while I agree with a lot of it, some of the approaches he uses, I don’t agree with long term, which is primarily, you know, ketogenic approach. There’s pros and cons of that. But he was able to replicate the same thing that that out of Warburg you know discovered in the early 1900s showing that, you know the metabolic side of cancer, specifically the mitochondria.

01:19:04:02 – 01:19:06:05
Nathan Crane
So you know, I just find that that really fascinating.

01:19:07:18 – 01:19:11:16
Dr. Dan Rubin
That sounds like fascinating work that you produced.

01:19:11:16 – 01:19:33:18
Nathan Crane
Yeah. It’s important that we realize what’s causing cancer so we can prevent it, right? I mean, you’re working with patients who have cancer and you’re helping save their lives, which is incredible, important work that you’re doing. And, you know, it’s like, man, we’ve got to learn as a society what’s causing it so we can stop being diagnosed it because it’s causing so much suffering in people.

01:19:34:07 – 01:19:38:16
Nathan Crane
And I know you’re here to help help stop that suffering just now.

01:19:39:12 – 01:19:41:05
Dr. Dan Rubin
Absolutely. This is great.

01:19:43:02 – 01:20:11:10
Nathan Crane
Awesome. Well, Dr. Rubin, it’s been great getting to know you. Appreciate appreciate you and all the work you’ve done. I had a question, dear, the board that you created naturopathic board the ME if I get to the the Oncology Association of Naturopathic Physicians, which you started, thank you for starting that. By the way, you’re the president of your current president or founding president of it.

01:20:11:10 – 01:20:11:16
Nathan Crane
Right?

01:20:11:17 – 01:20:16:02
Dr. Dan Rubin
And president. Right. Yeah, that was 004209 after five years.

01:20:16:13 – 01:20:24:09
Nathan Crane
Guys. I mean, that’s a huge thing. It’s super important. And I was going to ask, do you know, do you know Dr. Michael Carl fell.

01:20:25:20 – 01:20:30:11
Dr. Dan Rubin
For I don’t know, like. No, no, but no of of course.

01:20:30:17 – 01:20:33:20
Nathan Crane
Is he and is he is he in that? Do you know? He probably is.

01:20:34:14 – 01:20:36:06
Dr. Dan Rubin
I don’t know if he’s a member or not.

01:20:36:23 – 01:20:44:17
Nathan Crane
Well, if not, I’ll I’ll tell him he needs to be part of it. He’s a good friend of mine. He’s got a clinic. Clinic up in Idaho. He’s doing some pretty revolutionary work up there as well.

01:20:45:04 – 01:20:46:08
Dr. Dan Rubin
That’s awesome.

01:20:46:14 – 01:20:52:17
Nathan Crane
Yeah. But yeah, I mean, anything else you want to share before we wrap up?

01:20:52:17 – 01:21:25:20
Dr. Dan Rubin
I just it’s been fun being able to talk to you, sort of coming out of patient care and being able to express some of the stuff that we’re doing. Love the work that you’re doing and just so happy that out there in a in social media and podcast ville that you’re doing it with a moral compass, pointing the same direction that main points and it’s fulfilling and I just love your work and you’re influencing so many people the right way and so thank you for having me on.

01:21:26:10 – 01:21:41:13
Nathan Crane
Oh, that’s awesome. I really appreciate hearing that. Thank you so much. And love the work you’re doing. You’ve obviously a pioneer in this field and I’m very excited. Honored to have you here on a podcast. And how can people get in touch with you directly?

01:21:41:13 – 01:21:55:24
Dr. Dan Rubin
Oh, well, we have a phone number and it’s 4809901111. But of course, you know, we have we have a website and our URL is listen and care.com.

01:21:56:07 – 01:21:59:10
Nathan Crane
Nice listening account as it gives you URL. I like it.

01:21:59:13 – 01:22:05:06
Dr. Dan Rubin
Thank you. And then naturopathic specialist is on social media, but I couldn’t give the handles right now.

01:22:05:21 – 01:22:10:04
Nathan Crane
Awesome. Okay, good. Well, thanks so much. I really appreciate it.

01:22:10:04 – 01:22:10:09
Dr. Dan Rubin
It’s.